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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
was told by 2 different suzuki dealers not to use synthetic oil. one said don't do it on the first scheduled maintenance, but it'd be ok to use it after 3000 miles. the other said not to use it at all. the 2nd dealer said that since the engine and transmission use the same oil, using synth will cause the clutch to slip.

i'm not mechanically inclined at all, but i want to learn this stuff. what are your opinions?
 

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I usually wait until after 3000 miles. And all my bikes engine/trans share the same oil. What 's up with that guy ?
Am I missing something ?
 

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The dealer I used said after 3000 miles mainly because of the cylinder wall coating, [*Each bore is lined with Suzuki's race proven SCEM (Suzuki Composite Electrochemical Material) for optimum heat transfer, tighter piston-to-cylinder clearances and reduced weight ], but I took a chance and put in early based on other engines I've had, both car and bike.Â
 
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There is no reason that you can't use synthetic right out of the box. Some manufacturers are doing just that, BMW for one.

The main things to remember are:
1. Most important- use motorcycle specific oil. Automotive oils have additives which can lead to clutch slipping.

2. Use the proper grade- Suzuki reccommends 10w40 but others use 20w40 or 50 without problems.
 

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phaed said:
was told by 2 different suzuki dealers not to use synthetic oil. one said don't do it on the first scheduled maintenance, but it'd be ok to use it after 3000 miles. the other said not to use it at all. the 2nd dealer said that since the engine and transmission use the same oil, using synth will cause the clutch to slip.

i'm not mechanically inclined at all, but i want to learn this stuff. what are your opinions?
Well there half full of it. I dumped my first oil at 150 miles and replaced it with regular spectro 4 oil and plan on changing it again at 3000 miles with amsoil. I have not decided between 10w-40 or 20w-50. I ran Amsoil in my 1995 Vulcan 750 for over 10 years with no problems. I changed over to synthetic at about 3000 miles.
 

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My rule of thumb is to switch out the dealer oil after about 50 miles to a good dino oil, then switch to synthetic at the 600 mile point.

You won't have clutch slippage as long as you don't use an energy conserving oil. And the line about a synthetic damaging the cylinder coating is total baloney. ::)
 

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Well I changed the Oil today and put in approx 3.8 qts of Amsoil 10w-40 oil. I have 535 miles on the unit and I also changed the rear lube to Amsoil 75-90 weight; both are full synthetic. Took it out for a 25 lime ride and all is well. The tranny does up and downshift smoother and it doesn't clunk as much on downshift. It really is a noticeable differance. There were some metal shavings on the plugs, but very little. Rear end lube was dark but not overly dirty looking. Engine oil is still very dependant on when you check it. I say just measure out the 3.8 qts and put this amount in. When I first ran it on the driveway and shut it off. It did't show on the dipstick. Ran it around the block, shut off around 3 minutes and it checked out perfecty. JOHN
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
headvance, thanks so much. that article was great...a must read for anyone that wants give their engine TLC.
 

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z109r said:
  Haven't finished yet, but saved it.  :read:
Thanks for the excellent article........I have used Rotella 10W-40W exclusively in my motorcycles......whats produced for and used in diesel engines will without a doubt protect the internals on a motorcycle engine.
 

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Good article, but, "By starting from scratch and building up your oil molecules from little pieces, you can pretty much guarantee that every molecule in the oil is just like every other molecule, and therefore the properties are exactly what you designed in, not compromised by impurities from dead cockroach shells or whatever."

Ya gotta admit, those cockroaches sure have held up over time. ::)

I recently switched to Amsoil.
 

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My dealer told me "Absolutely NO Synthetic"..

He's been in the bike industry over 36 years. He was told by Suzuki not to run Synthetic in this motor. It's was an issue with the clutch plates..

looking to find out more on this issue.

Wacky
 
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Wacky174 said:
My dealer told me "Absolutely NO Synthetic"..

He's been in the bike industry over 36 years. He was told by Suzuki not to run Synthetic in this motor. It's was an issue with the clutch plates..

looking to find out more on this issue.

Wacky
I've used synthetic in everything (including my garden tractor) for years without a problem. The most important thing is to use "Motorcycle Specific" oil because additives that are in regular automotive oil will affect the clutch. Of course I've only been in the automotive industry for 31 years so I'm sure he's right :eek:.
 

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ANY Dealer that says "Don't use Synthetics" is Wacky... sorry for the pun..

I have been selling AMSOIL for over 22 years now and used it in bikes when there was no such thing as M/C oil without a problem. Especially now with AMSOIL having "Clutch Performance" Additives in their new MCF 10-40 and MCV 20-50.

First.. that oil link listed is way outdated... Oil, especially M/C Specific oil has changed drastically in the last year, let alone 5 or 8 years ago when that article was written.

"Dyno Oil" is somewhat of a misconception and so is the thinking "We are running out of Oil"... Oil comes from any decomposing material and can be made from Methane gas. Ever go by an oil field and see the "Eternal Flames" ? That is the Methane being burned off. Methane, under about 1000 lbs of pressure makes oil and they are already making oil from Methane, but it is too expensive at this time. As far as running out, we have used less than 2% of the Earth's deposits of oil, we are just bleeding off the easy to get to stuff for now. But the tree huggers will unite while the rest of us sit on our cans and just complain about them. Oh.... Vote for Gore.. Yeah that's it... The Idiot is still calling for the "End of The Internal Combustion Engine" That means our bikes too !!

I ship AMSOIL all over the US, Direct from the Warehouses, to Bikers that own everything from Aprilia's to Yamaha's, H-D's included. The only problem I have had is one bike a guy bought used, a V-Twin Kawi, that must have been ragged on pretty hard, the manual calls for a 40 wgt but it will blow a 40 wgt out whether Petroleum or Synthetic so this is a mechanical problem, NOT an oil problem. Nobody beats my prices.

The best practice I have seen was by "rynosback" dumping the "break-in" (no such thing anymore) oil at 50 miles and then again at 600.

I have a Classic Wing and a Yamaha V-Star, the Wing was changed over to AMSOIL at 58,000 (when I bought it) and the Star was changed at 600. No Problems with either.

I have a 28 page "White Paper" that tested the top, I believe, 28 M/C oils . I will be trying to work with the Administrator here to get this posted.
 

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The shop foreman at Ron Ayers in Greenville, N.C. advised that they were instructed by Suzuki NOT to use synthetic oil in the 109's, no exceptions, because of the type of oil seals.
 

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dbritton1963 said:
The shop foreman at Ron Ayers in Greenville, N.C. advised that they were instructed by Suzuki NOT to use synthetic oil in the 109's, no exceptions, because of the type of oil seals.
If there were any chance that synthetic could damage anything, don't you think a warning to that effect would have been published in the owner's or service manuals?

What could the use of synthetic possible do to an oil seal, anyway? This doesn't really make any sense to me.
 

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I'm saying that I won't use it because I going to this weekend. My dealer was just stressing that Zuki told him not to use synthetic oil in the 109's do to seal and clutch issue's. I don't know why. My dealer sells synthetic for bikes all day long. I agree, if the 109 was not to have synthetic I would expect a BIG fat WARNING ! would appear on the bike and in the owners manual..

I use synthetic in my '69 Camaro, 2002 Camaro Z-28, 2004 Arctic Cats, Power boat, and kids 1/4 midgets with no problems.Â
 

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dbritton1963 said:
The shop foreman at Ron Ayers in Greenville, N.C. advised that they were instructed by Suzuki NOT to use synthetic oil in the 109's, no exceptions, because of the type of oil seals.
Ron Ayers in Greenville, N.C. just wants your money.
http://www.intruderalert.com/cafe/index.cfm?page=topic&topicID=78461 That thread contains my story in buying a couple of radio headsets from them. Longer story short:
I bought two headsets for $35 each on 4/24.
On 4/25, I noticed I ordered wrong sets. They were closed. So I ordered 2 correct sets and emailed them asking how much trouble it'd be and how much 'restocking fee' I'd need to pay, since parts hadn't left their store yet.
4/26 I get a reply that it wouldn't be a problem, but there would of course be a $17.50 restocking fee, and they would be taking care of the cancelling in just a moment.
4/26 I email back that I didn't WANT to cancel, was just inquiring about how much fees would be and if it would be a problem in doing so.
5/4, I still have no parts delivered, so I call. The original order (4/24...that was ordered, cancelled by them, and then reordered by them because of their screw up in cancelling and trying to con me out of $17.50), is on back order until 5/15.

Back order until 5/15? Yet they STILL wanted to charge me $17.50 to "restock it"? even though the dang thing aint' on their shelf to pull the stock from? :verymad:

I also got the correct headset order Wednesday. Guess what? Each headset is missing the 3 cables that allow me to connect them to the radios. I phone, get voice mail. I email, get no response. Next day I call...and am told that they will order two more sets, pull the missing cables and send them to me. They "should" get them by the end of next week. I "should" get them before May 23 (I'm doing RFTW...which is why I ordered the parts a month ahead of time!!! :verymad: :verymad:).

If I don't get the parts by May 23rd...I'll be coming home the long, 6 hours of extra riding, way, and stopping in Ron Ayers in Greenville, NC in person.

I will never, EVER, buy from them again....and I will tell every board and rider I see that mentions their store to never buy from them.

$17.50 to REstock something they don't even have in stock....Lamonster...sure am glad I read those rules about keeping this a 'SFW' site...or I'd be sling those special characters all over the place (like @(#*%@# stuff). :evil:

But they (RA) have me fighting mad! :verymad: :verymad: :verymad:
 

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Folks:

I have a question for the 109 board and readers of it, in general.

OIL is always a hot topic and there's always great debate on what oil one should use. With that in mind, I pose this question to all.

Has anyone ever had a engine failure or transmission failure ( this excludes slipping clutch) on a motorcycle you have personally owned and were driving when the failure occurred.

If you have had a failure as described above, please share with the board what oil you were using at the time of the failure and if the bike was being " abused ( redlining, power shifting under load, high RPM burnouts ) " beyond normal wear and tear.

With over 450 plus members giving input we could at least see if some failure trend exists with a specific oil wheather Dyno or Synthetic.
 
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