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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Dose the power commander 5 work with the 08 C and is anyone using it? I'm going to install a PC and have it dyno tuned with a switch installed so I can change from performance to economy on long trips. With the 5 all I need is a toggle switch to do this.
 

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The PCV works on all years of the M, but I do not kow about the C.

Check to see that the part numbers are the same on babbits. If so, your set.
 

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Only 2009 and newer

The PC 5 is only for 2009 and newer. Per their website...

The New Power Commander V is loaded with tons of new features. It is compatible with 2009 and newer bike models.
 

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The PC 5 is only for 2009 and newer. Per their website...

The New Power Commander V is loaded with tons of new features. It is compatible with 2009 and newer bike models.
Do not believe it. My PCV is on my 06 M109.

All of the part numbers that interact with the PCV were the same for the 06 and the 09, so I figured I would give it a try.

No issues. Even when I have called their tech guys for custom mapping tips with the Autotune, they all say they know it fits all years, but it was a marketing decision because they need to continue to produce the PCIII for bikes the PCV really does not fit yet, but that would be too few to justify making them, so they split their market by arbitrary years so people keep buying the PCIII.
 

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Thank you...

Too funny! But, that's great info that you passed on; thanks!

I was thinking about pulling the Bully Controller off my bike as it did not provide the HP/torque increase as advertised. But more importantly, it reverted back to the stock setting as it was purchased. :mad:

Having the PC 5 will allow me to get a custom dyno tune. :drool:

Do not believe it. My PCV is on my 06 M109.

All of the part numbers that interact with the PCV were the same for the 06 and the 09, so I figured I would give it a try.

No issues. Even when I have called their tech guys for custom mapping tips with the Autotune, they all say they know it fits all years, but it was a marketing decision because they need to continue to produce the PCIII for bikes the PCV really does not fit yet, but that would be too few to justify making them, so they split their market by arbitrary years so people keep buying the PCIII.
 

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I have been running a PCV on my M109 for a long time now and it works perfect. I also installed the auto tune option. It has my air fuel ration right on the money. Couldn't ask for anything better.
 

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Too funny! But, that's great info that you passed on; thanks!

I was thinking about pulling the Bully Controller off my bike as it did not provide the HP/torque increase as advertised. But more importantly, it reverted back to the stock setting as it was purchased. :mad:

Having the PC 5 will allow me to get a custom dyno tune. :drool:
The beauty of the PCV is the number of options you have.

For about what you pay to have it dynotuned, you can buy the Autotune bung and have the PCV constantly tuning for the conditions of the day.

I REALLY notice this when it started getting cold and I enden up riding home in the high 30F range.

When I had the PCIII, the colder air was not adjusted for, so it did not make that much of a difference, but with the PCV, it is a noticeable difference once it makes the adjustments to get back to the target AFR.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Well, I'll let you know. I purchased the PC5 w/auto tune last night and I will install it over the winter. I've spoken to the place that did my dyno tune last year and they're going to add a toggle switch and give me 2 custom maps for $300.00. 1 for performance and 1 for fuel economy (long smooth rides) I was told I could do this with the PC5 but I needed to add another $500.00 worth of parts to do it with the PC3.

I'm changing from the bully because of my dyno tune from last year. They had a hard time working around all the bad spots in the bully. At certain RPM's it would run very rich and at others it would run lean. I didn't spend that kind of money to get the inconsistency or cause problems down the road. I'm also thinking my numbers will increase as well. Michael, my numbers were less than advertised also.
 

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Well, I'll let you know. I purchased the PC5 w/auto tune last night and I will install it over the winter. I've spoken to the place that did my dyno tune last year and they're going to add a toggle switch and give me 2 custom maps for $300.00. 1 for performance and 1 for fuel economy (long smooth rides)
You spend your money how you like, but the autotune builds the maps, you just set the target AFRs. You can put together any targets you like in about 10 minutes.

If you are running autotune, you use both map slots. One slot stores the saved map and the second holds the 'live' map, with the changes it is making on that ride. Only once you accept those changes does the new map from that ride become the new saved map. So, at that point, both maps are the same until you go out for another ride.

If you have the toggle switch and are running autotune, flipping the switch accepts the new map and runs you on that saved map. flipping the switch again puts you back into the live mode where it will monitor and make changes.

So, simple answer is you can not run 2 maps and use autotune without buy a modual to store a 3rd map.

If you want 2 separate maps, then skip the autotune.

The solution is to make a 'hybrid' AFR table that gives you power where you need it and saves gas where you don't.

I rode and tracked where my rpms and throttle position (TP) were on a cruise ride and a performance ride.

On a cruise ride, I was shifting at 3k and rarely sustained a TP over 20% except in 5th gear on the highway.

On a performance ride, I spent most of my time above 3k and above a 20% TP and rarely hit 5th gear.

So there was my line so my target AFRs go something like this:
1st on the rich side the whole way;
2nd - 4th run on the lean side below 3k rpms or below 20%TP and on the rich side above 3k rpms or above 20%TP;
5th gear runs on the lean side the whole way.

That set of targets gained me as much as 6mpg tank average over prior straight out performance maps and was only 3mpg down from my best with a full economy map and a tank to tank highway run.

On any given ride, I am sure to do a little cruising and a little pushing things. My 'hybrid' AFR table gives me power where I want it and saves gas where I do not need it and all without needing to decide which way I want to go or even flipping a switch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
You spend your money how you like, but the autotune builds the maps, you just set the target AFRs. You can put together any targets you like in about 10 minutes.

If you are running autotune, you use both map slots. One slot stores the saved map and the second holds the 'live' map, with the changes it is making on that ride. Only once you accept those changes does the new map from that ride become the new saved map. So, at that point, both maps are the same until you go out for another ride.

If you have the toggle switch and are running autotune, flipping the switch accepts the new map and runs you on that saved map. flipping the switch again puts you back into the live mode where it will monitor and make changes.

So, simple answer is you can not run 2 maps and use autotune without buy a modual to store a 3rd map.

If you want 2 separate maps, then skip the autotune.

The solution is to make a 'hybrid' AFR table that gives you power where you need it and saves gas where you don't.

I rode and tracked where my rpms and throttle position (TP) were on a cruise ride and a performance ride.

On a cruise ride, I was shifting at 3k and rarely sustained a TP over 20% except in 5th gear on the highway.

On a performance ride, I spent most of my time above 3k and above a 20% TP and rarely hit 5th gear.

So there was my line so my target AFRs go something like this:
1st on the rich side the whole way;
2nd - 4th run on the lean side below 3k rpms or below 20%TP and on the rich side above 3k rpms or above 20%TP;
5th gear runs on the lean side the whole way.

That set of targets gained me as much as 6mpg tank average over prior straight out performance maps and was only 3mpg down from my best with a full economy map and a tank to tank highway run.

On any given ride, I am sure to do a little cruising and a little pushing things. My 'hybrid' AFR table gives me power where I want it and saves gas where I do not need it and all without needing to decide which way I want to go or even flipping a switch.
Thank you. That is some good information. I emailed PC and the dyno tuning center asking this again, because this isn't what they told me before I made the purchase. Maybe we had some misunderstanding about what my intentions were. I'll let you know what they say.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
From Dynojet

You need a simple on/off toggle switch to toggle maps in the Power Commander. You cannot use the map switch feature and auto-tune simultaneously. You would first need to build your 2 maps with the auto-tune then disable auto-tune and enable the map switch feature. Then send in your 2 maps and run them as static tunes. The map switch can be used to turn auto-tune on/off on the fly if the auto-tune feature is enabled.

Let me know if you have any further questions.

Regards,

Chris Kelly
Dynojet Research Inc.
2191 Mendenhall Dr. Suite 105
North Las Vegas, NV 89081
1-800-992-4993
 

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You need a simple on/off toggle switch to toggle maps in the Power Commander. You cannot use the map switch feature and auto-tune simultaneously. You would first need to build your 2 maps with the auto-tune then disable auto-tune and enable the map switch feature. Then send in your 2 maps and run them as static tunes. The map switch can be used to turn auto-tune on/off on the fly if the auto-tune feature is enabled.

Let me know if you have any further questions.

Regards,

Chris Kelly
Dynojet Research Inc.
2191 Mendenhall Dr. Suite 105
North Las Vegas, NV 89081
1-800-992-4993
That is basically a much simpler explanation of the same thing I was telling you.

You can either run autotune or two maps, but you can not run both at the same time.
 

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I'm changing from the bully because of my dyno tune from last year. They had a hard time working around all the bad spots in the bully. At certain RPM's it would run very rich and at others it would run lean. I didn't spend that kind of money to get the inconsistency or cause problems down the road. I'm also thinking my numbers will increase as well. Michael, my numbers were less than advertised also.
Make sure you don't get caught in the trap that your A/F ratios need to be flat to be good. Ratios change at different rpm's to produce the power the motor needs.

I know you are relying on the input of the dyno techician that does the dyno work for you and I have spent several years 'discussing' results with seasoned dyno techs, but seeing the AF ratio move up and down does not mean you have lost power or have a mistuned bike and if yoru dyno guy started moving the Bully's settings around chances are they have not done it any justice.

I know this sounds like I'm just defending the Bully, but it's really not. I run all my bikes on the same dyno as one of the biggest PowerCommanders tuning dyno's on the west coast and we are constantly comparing their Tuning Link results with mone. We just compared an M109R yesteday and were able to add 2HP more with the Bully over the PCiii that was installed on the bike. The PC was tuned a year ago when installed and hadn't been changed.

It has taken me 2 yrs to convince the tech that runs this dyno that the Bully could do what it states. He, like man others, are so engrained by PC on their controller that nothing else comes close. I've had many a call from a tech asking how to adjust the Bully which gives me an opportunity to discuss it's benefits with them and how it actually works.

I don't fault you. You're taking a trained professionals word for it and that's what he's hired for, right. ;->
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Well said, but I installed the bully late winter, early spring of 2009 and I have been wondering if your claims were true or not so in the spring of 2010 I took my bike in to see. He worked on her for an hour and 40 minutes And he couldn't get anywhere near your claims. I also have your intake and the plastic tabs that are used to mount it to the bike have cracked, split. I had to cut small pieces of aluminum and paint them black to hold your intake on so I could finish out the summer. I'm in the process of making my own intake. After I get this done and install my new PC I'll take her in for the tune. Gman, I haven't been impressed.
 

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Gman, I haven't been impressed.
I apologize if you feel you've been misled. I've been running the same setup for 18,000 hard miles without failure of any part, nor signs of wear.

My dyno results are what I experienced, without tweaking the numbers to make it look better and I have the same pipes you have so I am puzzled. Not quite sure how the tech can tune for an hour and 40 as it's simple button pushing for ajustments. It doesn't surprise me that he wanted to direct you towards the PC, I have the same response from many a trained PC tech.

I would appreciate an opportunity to make your experience a better one, everything I do has a 2 yr warranty. Drop me a note and maybe I can help you feel better about your setup.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I apologize if you feel you've been misled. I've been running the same setup for 18,000 hard miles without failure of any part, nor signs of wear.

My dyno results are what I experienced, without tweaking the numbers to make it look better and I have the same pipes you have so I am puzzled. Not quite sure how the tech can tune for an hour and 40 as it's simple button pushing for ajustments. It doesn't surprise me that he wanted to direct you towards the PC, I have the same response from many a trained PC tech.

I would appreciate an opportunity to make your experience a better one, everything I do has a 2 yr warranty. Drop me a note and maybe I can help you feel better about your setup.
Sorry it took so long for me to get back with you but this is how I keep your K&N intake on my bike.





 

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I apologize if you feel you've been misled. I've been running the same setup for 18,000 hard miles without failure of any part, nor signs of wear.

My dyno results are what I experienced, without tweaking the numbers to make it look better and I have the same pipes you have so I am puzzled. Not quite sure how the tech can tune for an hour and 40 as it's simple button pushing for ajustments. It doesn't surprise me that he wanted to direct you towards the PC, I have the same response from many a trained PC tech.

I would appreciate an opportunity to make your experience a better one, everything I do has a 2 yr warranty. Drop me a note and maybe I can help you feel better about your setup.
I have to admit Gman, that's stepping up to the plate!
 

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Every time I read posts likenthis I immediately getting all fired up to do all these upgrades and tweaks. But after a while I am cooling down realizing that all this money spent on upgrades will give me couple of extra HP and a little more torque. And I say screw it. I already have powerful bike. I,ll save $$ for a second bike instead.

But I have to say that I am Gman customer for almost 4 years now and he always helpful before and after the deal and his products and services are top notch.


PS. Still waiting for radiator solution for c109.
 

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I guess we'll see. Words are one thing and actions are another.
Are both of your intakes in that condition?
At what point in your putting on and taking off did they start to show signs of failure?
Did you mount them using the stock rubber/metal spacers originally?
I assume you are not running with the chrome covers in the pics so you can show the damaged areas?
Are you riding your bike currently or can you remove the damaged ones and send them back for review and not be out a ride?

The questions are for my diagnosis and to help eliminate another customer from having the problem you have experienced. I have had my setup on and off maybe 30 times over the past 2 years and outside of one of the chrome air filter connections stripping on me because I used a power screwdriver one day in a hurry, all has worked flawlessly. I need to figure out why yours hasn't, but like I said all is under warranty so no worries, all you will be out is some of your wrenching time and a shipping to get them here. Return shipping will be free.
 
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