Fork Springs Spacer
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Thread: Fork Springs Spacer

  1. #1
    Member J.R.'s Avatar
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    Default Fork Springs Spacer

    Hi all,
    Thanks to Some9 video on forks spring removal, Went ahead and removed mine from the 07 to upgrade to Racetech 1.0 Springs. My question is do I need to add a "nipple" to the bottom of the new pvc pipe "spacer" so a piece goes into the the spring? Or simply sit the 1" pvc on top of the spring?? It appears to sit on it nice and flat, just wondering if it needs a reduced tip to fit inside the new springs...

    Thnks all.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.R. View Post
    Hi all,
    Thanks to Some9 video on forks spring removal, Went ahead and removed mine from the 07 to upgrade to Racetech 1.0 Springs. My question is do I need to add a "nipple" to the bottom of the new pvc pipe "spacer" so a piece goes into the the spring? Or simply sit the 1" pvc on top of the spring?? It appears to sit on it nice and flat, just wondering if it needs a reduced tip to fit inside the new springs...

    Thnks all.
    I have that Fork Upgrade/Mod on two of my 9s, and neither of them were done with a nipple of any sort on the end of the Spacer that butts up to the Fork Spring.

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    Member J.R.'s Avatar
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    Default Awesome. Thanks!!!

    Thank you for the quick response. Will proceed to intall and feeback later...
    J.R.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.R. View Post
    Thank you for the quick response. Will proceed to intall and feeback later...
    J.R.
    Good deal Bro. If you follow Some9ís video instructions to the letter, youíll have absolutely no problems with the outcome.

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    Active Member Stalker's Avatar
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    Its been several years since I have upgraded a set of fork springs, but I seem to remember putting a washer on top of the springs and the 1" PVC pipe sits on top of the washer.

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    Very Active Member Andy33's Avatar
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    Did this mods years back too. Never did any "nipple" Just put the PVC on the top of the spring.

    - Cant remember if there was a washer or not.... Would check a parts diagram.
    2009 M109 LE
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    RaceTech fork Springs, Progressive 465, LA Choppers 2" bones, Cycle House Kickstand, Chrome Stock Wheels, Freedom Exhaust, Goldwing Intake MOD + K&N filters, Cobra Power Pro


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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    I strongly doubt that many, if any, have used a washer between the PVC Tube and the Fork Spring. Iíve reviewed that video that Some9 created several times in the past, and I donít even vaguely remember there having been a washer used.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JUDAH-9 View Post
    I strongly doubt that many, if any, have used a washer between the PVC Tube and the Fork Spring. I’ve reviewed that video that Some9 created several times in the past, and I don’t even vaguely remember there having been a washer used.
    Did you install your springs yourself or pay to have someone else do them for you?

    From your post's I kinda get the impression you do a lot of reading and watching youtube videos but are not actually doing a lot of wrenching on your bike yourself.

    Here is a copy/paste from the installation instructions for the Sonic Springs.

    10) Set the fork oil level.(Level is defined as the distance between the top of the fork tube and the top of the oil in the tube, and is set with the spring and spacer out, forks collapsed. Because of the way it’s measured, a smaller number means more oil.) A handy item for this is a turkey baster. Measure the desired distance from the tip up and mark that spot with a Sharpie or a piece of tape. Make sure that there’s a little more oil than needed in the tube, then align the mark with the top of the fork tube and suck any excess out. Put in the new spring, the washer that came with it, the spacer and the stock washer, if any.

    NOTE A: Cutting spacers
    The purpose of the spacers is to provide the proper amount of pre-load on the springs. In general, street bikes need about ĺ” of pre-load, assuming that the spring rate is correct for the weight of the bike and rider. So the question is, how do we determine the right length for the spacer?
    Take the fork cap, and if it has a pre-load adjustment, set it in the middle. Now measure the depth of the cap from the bottom to the base of the portion that sits against the top of the fork tube. Include any stock washer that will sit on top of the spacer. Basically we’re measuring the length of the portion that fits inside the fork tube.
    Say for example that this length is 2”. If we cut the spacer so that with the spring, washer and spacer installed it came up flush with the top of the fork tube, when we installed the fork cap the spring would be compressed 2”. Too much. So we need to cut the spacer shorter to get the proper pre-load. In this case 1 ľ” shorter. Easiest way to measure this is to put the spring, washer and uncut spacer in the extended fork leg. Mark the spacer tube even with the top of the fork tube. Pull the spacer out and measure 1 ľ” down from the mark. Mark and cut from that point. Now, when you put the spring, washer and spacer in, the top of the spacer should be 1 ľ” below the top of the fork tube. When the fork cap is installed, the 2” section inside the fork tube will compress the spring ĺ”. Voila, correct pre-load!! Just make sure you use the right numbers for you, not the ones in this example. Also, back the adjuster all the way back out before re-installing the fork cap, to make it easier to get the threads started. Re-set the adjuster to the middle position after everything is bolted back up.

    It would make little since to have a piece of PVC pipe rest on top of the spring itself for a number of reasons.
    The original preload spacers on the M109R have a taper and insert into the springs to keep it aligned.
    When you cut your own PVC pipe to make new preload spacers you no longer have this and NEED to install a washer between the spring and the new spacer.
    Having the washer adds surface area to press against the spring and for the PVC preload spacer to sit upon.
    That is why washers are supplied with the new springs.

    So I strongly doubt those who did not use washers did the job correctly.


    Also if I remember correctly the video you are speaking of was a "Going In Blind" video, meaning that it was the very first time he had ever done it himself.
    Last edited by Stalker; 06-06-2020 at 02:00 PM.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    I did have someone do the mod on both of my 9s. I watched mechanic do the Fork Spring mod on my 07í and I know he didnít add any washers. That mod was done back in 2010, and I havenít had any issues with the forks since the mod was completed. On my 08í Iím not 100% sure if washers were used or not. However, I did have an issue with one of the forks on that bike. I canít say for certain if using washers or not actually has any impact on how the forks perform or hold up over time. I guess itís a matter of preference or how one looks at the importance of the need for washers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JUDAH-9 View Post
    I did have someone do the mod on both of my 9s. I watched mechanic do the Fork Spring mod on my 07’ and I know he didn’t add any washers. That mod was done back in 2010, and I haven’t had any issues with the forks since the mod was completed. On my 08’ I’m not 100% sure if washers were used or not. However, I did have an issue with one of the forks on that bike. I can’t say for certain if using washers or not actually has any impact on how the forks perform or hold up over time. I guess it’s a matter of preference or how one looks at the importance of the need for washers.
    Its all comes down to simple physics.

    If you had a piece of 2x4 lumber and were forced to stand on it for 24 hours straight would you choose to stand on the 1.5 inch side or the 3.5 inch side.

    Same thing applies here.

    The PVC pipe is not going to stay centered on the spring since it does not have a taper as the stock spacer does.

    Therefore it is not going to apply pressure evenly over the spring.

    With the added surface area of the washer this is accomplished.

    It is not a matter of preference, it is a matter of doing the job right or wrong.

    I just looked up the Race Tech spring installation instructions and they call for the use of a washer between the spring and spacer as well.

    Race Tech actually calls for 4 washers to be used, one on the top and one on the bottom side of each preload spacer.
    Last edited by Stalker; 06-05-2020 at 07:25 PM.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    👍

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    Very Active Member Chilly Rock's Avatar
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    I used a nipple with the washer. I think I used 3/4" to 1/2" pvc adapter and the 1/2" end fit through the washer. I did it way to make sure the pvc wouldn't move or slide around too much.

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    Very Active Member BIG MIKE 109R's Avatar
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    I purchased my 1.1 Sonic fork springs from Mean Cycles and was going to install myself. I was pressed for time before the MAM 2018 so I had Tapped Out Cycles install. They used washers on the installation.

    JESUS IS LORD! 2008 Candy Max Orange Debeavered, Yana Shiki 2" bones, Grasshopper backrest, V&H Big Shots, Dunlop Elite-3 250 rear, Dunlop D251 150 front, LED brake lights, micro brite rear turn signals, Arlen Ness billet chrome grips, smoothie rear fender, ATRE, Wolo horn, Scorp motor mounts, Gel seat, Chrome M109R derby cover, A&R 6K HID.
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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    Okay, so I stand corrected. Apparently it is necessary to add the washers. In all honesty, it does make sense to add them. However, I donít recall the bike mechanic having used them when he did the mod/upgrade on my 07í model. I guess itís very possible that he did use them, and I just didnít notice when he did install them. My best friend was there with me that day, and I couldíve been distracted by some side-bar conversation with him at the time. After reading these responses, Iím sure Matt (FuturR) likely used washers when he did the mod/upgrade on my 08í model just slightly over a year ago.

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    Very Active Member Chilly Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUDAH-9 View Post
    Okay, so I stand corrected. Apparently it is necessary to add the washers. In all honesty, it does make sense to add them. However, I donít recall the bike mechanic having used them when he did the mod/upgrade on my 07í model. I guess itís very possible that he did use them, and I just didnít notice when he did install them. My best friend was there with me that day, and I couldíve been distracted by some side-bar conversation with him at the time. After reading these responses, Iím sure Matt (FuturR) likely used washers when he did the mod/upgrade on my 08í model just slightly over a year ago.
    I wouldn't say it's necessary to add washers but more of a personal option. For me it was for peace of mind to add the washers for pvc stability and knowing it wouldn't hurt by adding them.

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    Very Active Member M109Dreamer's Avatar
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    I just did mine a few months ago. The washers that come with the spring get installed bewteen the spacer and spring. I installed one on mine. I talked to race tech and the key being is to get the overall length correct. Its on their website or just measure the stock pring and stock spacer for the length. I used 1 washer on each. I also didnt taper the PCV up at the cap to fit flush because I forgot. But when I released the straps the PVC sits about 1/8" from the top againt the cone. I wasnt going to disassemble it just for that. Its just a tad more preload. Race tech also said once you get it installed you can add more washers as needed if you wanted to stiffen it up a bit more. I am running 1.1's

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chilly Rock View Post
    I wouldn't say it's necessary to add washers but more of a personal option. For me it was for peace of mind to add the washers for pvc stability and knowing it wouldn't hurt by adding them.
    The point youíre making here is the same point I tried to make in one of my earlier posts.👍 I see this as as being no different than some M109R owners on this Forum who firmly stand by their decision to run/mount their 160/60 tire in the conventional direction, and some being adamant about running/mounted their 160/60 tire in the reverse direction. Both have reported time and time again that theyíve had ďNOĒ issues with performance, longevity, or safety in having the tire mounted in either direction. So, whoís to say one method is right and the other is wrong? Iíve learned that at some point, I have to take the high road, to avoid the back and forth. At the end of the day, my point to anyone here is...to each his/her own...and I hope everyone out there rides safe, and has fun doing so.

    Iím out!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JUDAH-9 View Post
    So, who’s to say one method is right and the other is wrong? I’ve learned that at some point, I have to take the high road, to avoid the back and forth. At the end of the day, my point to anyone here is...to each his/her own...and I hope everyone out there rides safe, and has fun doing so.
    WOW, you are persistent little fellow aren't you?

    It is not a matter of "to each his/her own" when your giving information to another person. If you want to do that on your bike then go for it, but to tell others its ok is simply irresponsible and if you were a business it would be out right liable.

    Pretty hard to take this statement by Race Tech as anything except face value.

    STEP 4 - Install the springs, spacers (if required) and washers. If you use spacers, you must have washers on both ends of the spacer. Never let the spring ride directly on the aluminum cap or the spacer. A steel washer should always be between any aluminum cap and the spring.
    Not sure how the words "Never & Always" can be twisted into "Maybe & Sometimes" just because you feel its fine to so.

    Why after seeing this would you in good conscious keep trying to convince anyone to do otherwise.

    Also how is it you see yourself as"Taking the High Road", giving bad information about something you obviously know nothing about and then repeatedly trying to justify that position is not the definition of taking the high road.

    Read back over your post at how you responded to me when I first told the OP a washer needed to be used and then ask yourself again if you are taking the high road or just grasping at straws trying to save face.

    You pretty much had a smug "Holier Than Thou" attitude in your response, then later came back saying that you really had no clue how it is supposed to go together and you do not even know for sure how your own bike is assembled.

    Taking the high road, are you kidding me?

    If you were really taking the high road you would have just said "Oops sorry I was wrong and did not know what I was talking about, because I have never actually done this mod myself. I have only watched a video on it years ago and kind of half-assed saw someone doing it once 10 years ago but I was not really paying attention".

    Then sat quietly on the side line and let it go.

    Anyway,

    Here is the link to the complete Race Tech & Sonic Spring installation instructions for anyone reading this post in the future so they can be sure to get the correct information in print from the manufacturer.

    https://racetech.com/download/Instru...%20Springs.pdf

    http://sonicsprings.com/catalog/damp...ch_article.php
    Last edited by Stalker; 06-07-2020 at 01:54 AM.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    Here we go...another tyrant on the loose. Iím not going to give you any energy to carry on with your tirade. Your the best little fella.👍

    Have a good one!!!

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    You have a very warped since of reality there snowflake.

    Maybe put on your reading glasses and give this thread another read.

    If the only conclusion you come to after reading it again is that "I am a tyrant" then that says a lot about who you really are.

    In fact just to show you I am the bigger man, if you can find one thing I said anywhere in this thread that is not true, I will apologize even though I have no reason and proclaim you "The King of Siam"

    You were wrong and you barked at me as if I was an idiot for what I said, yet you call me a tyrant, instead of just apologizing to me and letting it go.

    No shame in being wrong but saying the same wrong thing over and over again trying to make others believe it just to save face is idiotic.

    If calling me a tyrant helps you sleep better tonight, then hey you go for it.

    Its all here, printed in english for the world to see. You interpret it how your mind sees it, no matter how twisted that might be.

    If the OP actually went though the time and expense to put his bike together the way you told him to, then comes back and reads this thread to see what has been posted since, I will bet he calls someone something also.

    I doubt it will be calling me a tyrant but I can think of a few choice words he may want to call you for giving advice on something you know nothing about, costing him time, money and aggravation.

    And that my friend is what this is really all about, even though you are too blind to see it or too proud to admit it.
    Last edited by Stalker; 06-07-2020 at 02:20 AM.

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    Very Active Member JUDAH-9's Avatar
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    At no time did I bark anything at you or anyone else. I simply stated ďI doubt many, if any at all, used a washer on this mod.Ē Apparently, some of them have...and thatís fine and acceptable by me. You then went into overdrive trying to prove your point/opinion/method regarding the mod. You got upset, because I didnít necessarily agree with you. You must have very thin skin, and are extremely-sensitive, if you took my comments in such a manner that caused your emotions to get the best of you in the way youíre displaying. Perhaps itís also a matter of you possibly having an insatiable desire to be right all the time, and itís manifesting itself on this Forum. Or, you just might be trying to establish yourself as a ďResident Expert/Guru/Mr. Know It All on this Forum, and youíre using this as an opportunity to promote yourself. I donít know what your problem is, and I really donít care. No one here is forced to do anything. However, you seem to lose your mind, if someone has a different opinion or experience than yours. The OP is an adult who can choose for, and speak for himself.

    You took the time to copy and paste instructions from Race Tech, and basically acted like you were demanding that everyone MUST follow those instructions to the letter. The point I was making when I responded Chilli Rock was METZELER had very similar instructions out there that was posted on this Forum in the past. The instructions stated their METZELER 160/60/R18 Rear Tire should be mounted in the reverse direction when the tire is being used as a front tire. The instructions included both the positives and negatives, based on how the tire would perform in each respective direction. Some here have followed that guidance, and some have not. Regardless, all of them have posted their contentment and success with how they chose to install the tire on their respective bikes. Whether you agree or not, two differing methods and opinions can work and be true at the same time.

    Calm down guy! If it makes you feel better, Iíll concede you are correct about the use of the washers. 👍

  24. #22
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    LOL, whatever snowflake.

    You believe what you want to believe, the facts speak for themselves.

    OP came here looking for a correct answer, I simply proved him with the correct answer, thought that was the whole objective of this forum.

    So if that makes me a know it all in your mind, then so be it. Better to be a smart ass than a dumb ass.

    Everything that needs to be said has already been said and you have stated you are "out of here" several times already, yet here you are again.

    If you want it to die then just let it die, if you want to keep going back and forth, then keep coming back running your mouth.

    I have all day and honestly enjoy the debate, especially when its easy like this.
    Last edited by Stalker; 06-07-2020 at 04:47 PM.

  25. #23
    Member J.R.'s Avatar
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    Thanks for the feedback. I did install the included washer between new Spring and new ~8-1/4" long Spacer. I also applied a little heat to the Spacer (1"pvc) to expand it so it would fit into the fork cap like the original did. Now I have a different problem and I think has to do with the preload not set right. Went for a test ride and I feel a Hard "thump" through the handlebar when the shock extends. Seems Fine when the shock compresses and cornering feels much better. I weight about 240lbs and the new Racetech springs are 1.0. The one thing I most likely screwed up was the fork cap adjustment. I screwed it in all the way then secured the nut up against it. ?? What Could the hard thump be ? Help!!! Thnks

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    Hi, I'm assuming you have measured and set your preload to the recommended setting by dry assembly and measuring the gap between cap and spring and adding preload measurement

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